Talking about sexual harassment is hard, for many reasons. I hear, this week, with the downfall of Harvey Weinstein, so many people talking about women not saying anything because of fear of retribution. But I think it is even more than that. The dichotomy of someone who is powerful, wealthy, well-known, successful ... being accused by someone who is often young, not powerful, not accomplished. It's even embarrassing to the person who has been harassed. I know that because I've been there.

It is still embarrassing to me, after 38 years.

And not even the embarrassment. Often, the person who is doing the harassing has done a lot of good in the world as well. Look at Harvey Weinstein. He's been responsible for wonderful films, changed the lives of people, given major contributions to causes that, in my opinion, are well worth supporting.

How do you weigh ... putting up with some harassment, being embarrassed, maybe even having sex ... but in return your life is changed, you have major money and influence yourself, and you can do a lot of good in the world? 

I would guess that is a compromise that a lot of people have been willing to make. (I think that anyone who works with Woody Allen probably has some major justifying or denial going on.) 

When Anita Hill was castigated about not having come forward earlier, I really got it. When something stupid and embarrassing happens to you, you (or at least, I) did not even want to admit it happened.

And there's that thing about the other parts of the harasser ... the good parts. Do you take someone down for being a creep? Ruin their career for not getting boundaries? There is a lot of grey area without someone actually being raped. Sometimes the person being harassed just isn't sure how to weigh that moral decision. 

Now, at age 63, I have a lot of friends who are professors. I can talk to them on pretty much an equal level, understanding that their professional and academic expertise are one thing ... but opinions on child-raising, politics, climate change, religion and real estate are fair game for equal talk.

But at age 24, in December 1978, I was a little bit in awe of the physics professors I worked for at Indiana University. There were eight of them.

The very first day on the job, the head secretary, Betty Burhans, said to me, "Dick and Alex are the ones who are bringing in the money to this department (High Energy Physics) so you make sure those two are happy before anybody else."

I began to understand that making Dick Heinz happy might involve more than typing when he told me to let his mistress come to his office, but to call him for anybody else.

Then, he began locking the door of my little office in Swain Hall behind him, and telling me that he needed a massage. My reply was always "You're married. Ask your wife to give you a massage."

There were rumors that he had been caught having sex on a table in Swain Hall with an undergrad, but I have no proof of that. But that's the kind of talk that was going around about him in the department.

Then, one day, I went to Nick's for happy hour on a Friday with a bunch of the grad students who had become my friends. Dick Heinz sat down beside me, and I felt his hand creep up under my skirt. I grabbed his wrist and yanked his hand away from me. He said "Your ass is out of here." Foolishly, I said "You can't do anything to me. I do my work."

I was so wrong. Dick began bringing a sheet of paper to me (this was when the Physics Department had only a couple of computers, and they were for scientific, not secretarial, use) and saying "I want you to cut and paste the changes." I would say, "Oh, c'mon, Dick, it would be much faster to just retype it." And I didn't GET that he was keeping notes: "Lynne cannot follow directions."

It was pretty miserable. I was tense all the time. I was afraid to be in my office. 

And, I was young. I drank too much one night and fooled around with one of the grad students. A couple of days later, another grad student came up to me as I was eating lunch at the Gables. He was a physics star, must have been a post-doc. I remember they were really happy to have him come to Indiana. And he was married. But he sat down at my table and said "So I hear you're fun. When do I get a turn?"

Now, I would think of that as a toxic, unhealthy, oppressive atmosphere. Then, I just thought it was all my fault.

In March, Betty Burhans (the head secretary) came to me and said "Dick and Alex don't like you. I'll give you either of the other two jobs open in Physics or I'll fire you on paper so you can get unemployment. This isn't your fault. I think you're the third one in a year."

And of course, she had my review, in which there were several things of the "she can't follow directions" type.

I told Betty I would have a nervous breakdown if I stayed in Physics and had to see him in the hall. So we agreed that she would "fire" me, but I would stay for three weeks to train my replacement and keep up with things.

Talk about humiliation. Working when everyone knew I was on the way out. 

Homer Neal, then the Dean of Research and Graduate Development, came to talk to me. (He was one of my professors, but I hardly ever saw him, as he worked out of his Dean's office mostly.) He said that seven doctoral students had been in his office to complain about what was happening to me, and that he would assist me through the grievance procedure. I told him, "Oh, no, Dr. Neal, I don't want to keep this job."

Not one person in authority told me that by NOT pursuing grievances, it was like admitting guilt. I could not have worked for the university for several years. Luckily, for most of those years, I was married and living in Boston. But, they did not warn me or inform me of any rights I might have.

On my last day, Dick Heinz said to me, "You're not too impressed with me, are you? Plenty of people around here are." I said "Well, Dick, I hear your wife put you through grad school. Maybe if you'd put her through grad school, she'd be the one sleeping around."

And Alex, his research partner, another brilliant man, stood by my work-study student on my last day. They had hired her to replace me. She was blonde and very pretty. She said "What is this word, Alex?" And he said, "Oh, that's the name of a college — R-U-T-G-E-R-S. You can always come to me with that kind of question." I stood there silently. Later, in private, I warned her what would happen.

And, really, the situation worked out well for me. I got unemployment for a few months, and in the summer, I met my future husband when he interviewed me for a job at his summer camp. He didn't hire me, but he did like me! In the fall, I took a job working in the back at Rudi's Bakery. I wanted to do something completely different from being a secretary. 

I did not mention this at all, except to my family and very few close friends, for years. 

And as I said, I totally got it that Anita Hill had not wanted to even talk about it when Clarence Thomas harassed her. The job stakes were much higher for her, as well.

At the beginning, when I said things were often grey, and that the accomplishments of the harasser might sometimes outweigh the harm done, I was thinking of the accomplishments of Harvey Weinstein, but also of Dick Heinz. Many people thought he was great. He evidently inspired many students. And I admire his making many people excited about science. My impression was that many in the Physics Department knew about the sexual harassment and Dick Heinz. But maybe Ben Brabson, who I greatly admire, didn't, or he could not have written this very complimentary speech about him. As I said, how do you weigh the harm that someone does and the good they accomplish?